Default holding music and copyright

Discussion in '3CX Phone System - General' started by oliverm, May 31, 2012.

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  1. oliverm

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    Hi

    We have a client who is being chased by PRS (Performing Rights Society) for copyright payments for the holding music in 3cx.

    Can anyone at 3cx confirm whether this music is copyrighted or not and whether the copyright holder has given their permission for it's use for public entertainment?

    The issue is that, if it can't be shown that it's either free of copyright or allowed for public broadcast and entertainment then the 3cx user is in breach of copyright and either has to pay the PRS for its use or stop using it (or face court).

    Can someone from 3cx confirm the current situation please?

    Olly
     
  2. active5

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    What country is the user located in?
    Is this the paid or free version of 3CX?

    I would also suggest sending an email to the nearest 3CX office that would have coverage for your user's location for clarification.

    Sounds like (no pun intended) that it's some sort of a bureaucratic shake down. Good luck.
     
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  3. active5

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  4. gschwab

    gschwab New Member

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    Actually it's not.
    http://www.ascap.com/licensing/licensingfaq.aspx
    http://www.bmi.com/licensing/faq

    There have been several companies in my area (SW Florida) that hve been fined for playing unlicensed music on hold or connecting a radio and using local broadcast stations (which I think is a lousy idea).
    It is a lot cheaper in the long run to use a professional scripting and voice talent service as they also can provide licensed background music for your messaging on hold and it sounds much more professional, but that's just my opinion.
     
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  5. oliverm

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    This is the free edition of 3cx though the music is the same as in other paid for editions.

    My concern is that we have pushed 3cx out to a number of clients now, other paid for editions, and if this is copyright music then really 3cx need to remove it as it's clearly inbreach. If it's not then they should be able to give us a statement to use in the next audit.

    Olly
     
  6. oliverm

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    I suppose also the obvious question is if we want beeps rather than music do we need to find a "beep" mp3 or will beeps be used if no MP3 is specified?

    Olly
     
  7. leejor

    leejor Well-Known Member

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    Obviously, this requires some clarification from 3CX, but, I would think it unlikely that the hold music, included in a PBX intended for use all over the world, is copyright material subject to legal action. It could be that they hold the copyright and allow exclusive use on their PBX.

    If you choose to use anything else,as hold music, unless you compose and perform it yourself, you are best off to purchase properly licensed material, or risk the wrath, at some point, of the "music police".
     
  8. SY

    SY Well-Known Member
    3CX Support

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    I hope that nobody is owner (a copyright and/or a patent) of the function "f(n)=a1*sin(n*(2*PI/F1))+a2*sin(n*(2*PI/F2))+a3*sin(n*(2*PI/F3))+..."... (except Fourier, who had defined it...)
     
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  9. leejor

    leejor Well-Known Member

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    Someone is probably running out to apply for the copyright, now...:)
     
  10. active5

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    The location of this incident, it appears to be a UK issue, meaning this particular situation with "PRS" is probably in the UK. "Performing Rights Society" is located in the UK with jurisdiction in the UK and Euro countries, unless there is another organization with the same name in another country. I don't think that ASCAP has jurisdiction in the UK. Copyright infringement issues are worldwide with problems ranging from blatant country specific piracy to ridiculous over zealot enforcement.

    What if you are playing Beethoven and Mozart? Copyrights expire after a certain number of decades upon the death of the author. No one gets paid for that music, if anyone wants to collect it I'll be glad to process payment of the money, I'll kindly total the funds and write a monthly check sending it to their last known resting place, I mean last known address.
     
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  11. leejor

    leejor Well-Known Member

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    Ah, but, technically, unless you performed the music yourself, someone else did. They could expect to be paid for your commercial use of their recording. Just as if Madonna released a version of a song written one hundred years ago, there may not be any royalties to use the song, but you can bet someone is going to pay if you want to play her version of it.

    Of course this (classical music part) is being extreme, the chances of someone being put on hold and recognizing "their" version of a piece of classical music, and wanting to go to the lengths of taking legal action.

    However, many people do, and are considering, using a radio station (XM/Sirius?) as their music on hold source, this could cause you grief if one of your callers happens to be a lawyer that works with the music industry, and is experiencing a lull in business.
     
  12. alex22alex

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    Hi,

    Can someone from 3CX please confirm the status of the copyright on the hold music in 3CX. With specific relation to the UK ?

    Warm Regards
     
  13. oliverm

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    I've tried all the contacts that we have at 3cx over the last 6 months or so but no one appears to be able to find out anything about it.

    I think the best course of action is to replace the holding music immediately as a matter of course.

    Olly
     
  14. leejor

    leejor Well-Known Member

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    Did you not see what SY posted on May 31st?

    To place a customer at risk of a possible copyright lawsuit is not good for business.
     
  15. ezpc

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    PRS chased a client of mine for playing a few tracks in a cafe that a local musician gave him.

    Whilst we should have clarification from 3CX on the matter, copyright on this group is a civil issue and not criminal - write a reply to the PRS and state that whilst you do not currently have a license, please can they provide proof and information that the song you are playing is protected and also by a member of theirs.

    If you do not get a response, or if you do but they are not able to show proof it is a member of theirs, simply leave it - it will not go any further.

    PRS can only sue/try to penalise people for music that belongs to their members - if they can't prove it, that should be enough due diligence... (nothing stopping the real owner raising a complaint at a later date, but, this will stop the PRS!).
     
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