New AI Features and Extension Fair Usage

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What???

We've got a 128sc Ent self-hosted on Linux system. The system info shows we have 1,846 extensions, which if I'm reading the Fair Usage Policy correctly, we will need to purchase a 512sc license at SIGNIFICANTLY higher cost.

Here's the deal though, unless this has changed in v20 update 7 or later, the way that M365 needs to be configured to support SSO, 3CX creates a dummy user with an extension when an AD user is created. There are over 750 of these users created by the M365 sync process, none of which should have an extension because they don't have a phone. I can't stay on top of deleting these 3cx users, especially because if I do delete them in the 3CX, they just get recreated at the next sync with new extension numbers. Maybe this can be fixed with some OU filtering in the M365 integration, but my domain admins are opposed to change the OU structure.

So, even without the 3CX users created by the M365 sync, we'd be at 1,096 users. This means having to upgrade to a 192sc with a relatively modest price increase. Then again, since a 192sc only allows 1,152 extensions, we would have a very small headroom of 56 extensions until we hit the maximum.

We're already paying for a 128sc license and rarely have more than 25 to 30 simultaneous calls. Having to go to a 192sc or 256sc is going to require a lot of explaining to my CIO...
You should use the sync selected users. It’s more work each time you add or remove someone but who wants extensions created that have no use anyway?
 
A little disappointed in this - charging for simultaneous calls (e.g. the more you use the phones the more value you're getting out the product and therefore the more you pay) was quite refreshing in a world where everything is cloud, now it seems like you want to move in that sort of direction anyway but are just shifting there gradually.

Your maximum extension numbers in relation to the sim. calls limit assumes a utilisation rate of 20% which in my experience is incredibly high for modern office-based users. Our 8 SC Pro license has 33 extensions created but in the 15 years we've been using 3CX we have never hit the calls limit. In the last 7 days this user base placed 21 calls and received 28 and we've been happily renewing 3CX each time it was due. If we start to hit extension limits I'm more likely to just have people give up a desk phone that they don't really use than pay to go up a level for additional capacity that we have no use for.

If you no longer need a phone system that's a different thing. But if you do, then a system that handles your comms needs for up to 40 people for $400 a year - its very inexpensive. So your response is equally disappointing to us. Your number of calls is very low indeed, but you could use it for internal comms with the apps if you like? Either way your 33 extensions fall well within the fair usage policy of an 8SC PRO license so you don't need to even upgrade anyways.
 
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We've got a 128sc Ent self-hosted on Linux system. The system info shows we have 1,846 extensions, which if I'm reading the Fair Usage Policy correctly, we will need to purchase a 512sc license at SIGNIFICANTLY higher cost.

Here's the deal though, unless this has changed in v20 update 7 or later, the way that M365 needs to be configured to support SSO, 3CX creates a dummy user with an extension when an AD user is created. There are over 750 of these users created by the M365 sync process, none of which should have an extension because they don't have a phone. I can't stay on top of deleting these 3cx users, especially because if I do delete them in the 3CX, they just get recreated at the next sync with new extension numbers. Maybe this can be fixed with some OU filtering in the M365 integration, but my domain admins are opposed to change the OU structure.

So, even without the 3CX users created by the M365 sync, we'd be at 1,096 users. This means having to upgrade to a 192sc with a relatively modest price increase. Then again, since a 192sc only allows 1,152 extensions, we would have a very small headroom of 56 extensions until we hit the maximum.

We're already paying for a 128sc license and rarely have more than 25 to 30 simultaneous calls. Having to go to a 192sc or 256sc is going to require a lot of explaining to my CIO...
We are working on group support for the M365 sync so you can more easily sync based on groups and you can thus remove all those extra users that need not be on a 3CX system. This is coming in update 9 within a few months.

I am not sure why it would be hard to explain to your CIO. You have a company with a whopping 1200 employees and you will be paying $9000 per year for 3CX - how is that expensive??
 
Question:
Does the new Extension Fair Usage Policy also apply to 3CX instances that have Multi-Tenant enabled with multiple tenants under the same license?
Yes of course.
 
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I completely appreciate @N_G / 3CX's position - a business has to make $. If they don't they fail to exist. Simple as that. :)
Without $, they can't employ people, they can't do R&D, they can't innovate which means you don't get any features.

SC licensing has always been a balance. It's no different to the days when we used to sell BRI and PRI ISDN.

Some customers had lots of users (handsets on desks), but make very few calls. Think about the phone that was in the kitchen which no one actually used, but it was there. It really was just internal so that people could communicate.
We used to sell lots of analogue and digital key systems with 100's of handsets but only 2 x ISDN2 or even 4 PSTN.

Some customers had not many users and made lots of calls and we had 8 handsets and 2 x ISDN10 PRI.

Even within the 3CX Model, we have many customers where they have high users, low call volume and SC requirement.
I think a lot of that also is contributed to the fact that many enterprises use Teams as their internal "Chat / Collaboration" and the 3CX deskphone as their "PSTN" external calling, so the volume profile has shifted.

No two customers have the same calling profile or user profile.
As I say, it's a balance.

3CX made it clear in their previous comms that they're looking to reduce their support costs / load and that was the change in the 4SC > 8SC. I completely get that supporting lots of small customers gets very time consuming and expensive. It also means people aren't investing in learning the product and being experts if they are not focused on it. Makes perfect sense. :)

The move to the MCM product in that smaller end of the market has made good economical sense, both for 3CX having to support fewer partners with bigger installs, and for us as partners being able to support less infrastructure with more users. ✅

Being able to define a "User" (a warm body) vs a "Service Account" (like a shared mailbox) would be good. That way, it's super clear as to what the definition and expectation on both sides is. Even being able to separate out VMBOX as a separate type perhaps? Just a thought.

Finding the happy medium in business is difficult, you'll not always please everyone all the time.
We've seen this for years on Open Source projects, where the project and the community have differing views.
We've seen it with Microsoft when they got rid of Small Business Server and Perpetual Office Licensing.

As long as it's fair and reasonable, where both parties can make a buck and provide a good service / product, then I think it's a good thing.

3CX has put a huge amount of dev effort in a small amount of time with v20. We've seen lots of new features with each release.
If we can get to feature parity on MCM to the Professional / Enterprise in each department, then we have many smaller customers who we would look to migrate from dedicated to MCM. Again, this is good for us both for support, infrastructure, licensing and maintenance. :)

You'll break some hearts @N_G, just stay focused and deliver good product and together, we'll all win. :)
Thank you so much for this in-depth and fair response! Indeed usage patterns are changing. Also a PBX is no longer something you install and never look at. Licensing only based on sim calls is no longer fair for 3CX. I believe the max extension usage is a fair balance - and the data proves it because 85% of customers are not effected. If you need a good car you cant go into the show room and say, well I plan on making only 10K miles this year versus 20K miles last year - can I get 50% discount on the new car? It doesn't work like that.

That said, personally I think making internal calls with 3CX is much easier than with teams.

3CX packs a lot of technology, there is a lot of updating behind the scenes to stay compatible with new and old hardware, voip providers, security issues. If you look at our price and compare it to other solutions we are just so much better value. Sure you can find a cheaper car, maybe smaller, less comfortable, less safe. Go ahead.

Not only are we open standards so that all the hardware you have and providers you have can be used with any SIP standard solution (unlike many other solutions that lock you in), we even have our configuration data format open so that you can easily take your configuration as well.
 
Question. We are a K12 school district with about 1,800 extensions. We had slowly rolled out 3CX over the past year and it was always our understanding there wasn't a maximum limit just recommendations on extensions based on how many SC you would have going on in the system. However, I understand licensing usage changes and that's fine I'm honestly not complaining. We love 3CX and continue to enjoy the product compared to other things on the market.. We're currently running a 128SC license and barely 20-30SC's are used at any particular time. We also had prepaid for years until 2028.

Could someone reach out to us directly on how this will affect us? I'm curious are we now out all the years prepaid or can we be credited back those years to apply to the correct licensing for us?

I'm all on board for buying the correct license needed and would have done so from the start if I was given the guidance or information from sales. It's just now we're kind of blind sided by this being in the middle of a budgeting year which runs from July to June every year and now we're going to be scrambling trying to come up with the difference in amounts to pay towards the correct licensing in the middle of a school year.
 
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Hi Nick, Extension Cap will clearly affect the higher SC 3CX Market for Bangladesh. The following user ranges according to SC are used here
8SC: 60-100 Users
16SC: 150-300 Users
24SC: 200-400 Users
32SC: 500-800 Users
48SC: 1,000-,1500 Users
64 SC: 1,200-2000 Users
Our existing clients are already using on above ranges. So your extension fair policy will definitely affect our existing higher SC clients for sure.
We strongly advise you to re-consider on your users cap.
 
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Question. We are a K12 school district with about 1,800 extensions. We had slowly rolled out 3CX over the past year and it was always our understanding there wasn't a maximum limit just recommendations on extensions based on how many SC you would have going on in the system. However, I understand licensing usage changes and that's fine I'm honestly not complaining. We love 3CX and continue to enjoy the product compared to other things on the market.. We're currently running a 128SC license and barely 20-30SC's are used at any particular time. We also had prepaid for years until 2028.

Could someone reach out to us directly on how this will affect us? I'm curious are we now out all the years prepaid or can we be credited back those years to apply to the correct licensing for us?

I'm all on board for buying the correct license needed and would have done so from the start if I was given the guidance or information from sales. It's just now we're kind of blind sided by this being in the middle of a budgeting year which runs from July to June every year and now we're going to be scrambling trying to come up with the difference in amounts to pay towards the correct licensing in the middle of a school year.
Thank you so much for your understanding. First off we are going to make discounts for K12 schools of course. So we can look into your case and consider the setup to make it a win win. Also, if it really does not work for you and you would rather move to another solution we would of course assist you in this process and refund you future years. But let us first look at your particular case because probably that is not necessary.
 
Hi Nick, Extension Cap will clearly affect the higher SC 3CX Market for Bangladesh. The following user ranges according to SC are used here
8SC: 60-100 Users
16SC: 150-300 Users
24SC: 200-400 Users
32SC: 500-800 Users
48SC: 1,000-,1500 Users
64 SC: 1,200-2000 Users
Our existing clients are already using on above ranges. So your extension fair policy will definitely affect our existing higher SC clients for sure.
We strongly advise you to re-consider on your users cap.
I am afraid a 100 users on an 8SC license is simply not interesting for us. Those companies best look for another solution.
 
Thank you so much for your understanding. First off we are going to make discounts for K12 schools of course. So we can look into your case and consider the setup to make it a win win. Also, if it really does not work for you and you would rather move to another solution we would of course assist you in this process and refund you future years. But let us first look at your particular case because probably that is not necessary.
Sounds good, Thank you guys!

Also, please note we're not looking to move to another solution at all. We are huge fans of 3CX you guys make an amazing product and our school district loves it compared to other products on the market we have tested. I've promoted 3CX at every turn in our state to other schools looking to get away from older systems and upgrade. Thanks again look forward to the discussion.
 
Sounds good, Thank you guys!

Also, please note we're not looking to move to another solution at all. We are huge fans of 3CX you guys make an amazing product and our school district loves it compared to other products on the market we have tested. I've promoted 3CX at every turn in our state to other schools looking to get away from older systems and upgrade. Thanks again look forward to the discussion.
Thank you so much for your nice words, my team and myself really appreciate it that you value our solution and that you can understand our reasoning!
 
Thank you for the detailed updates and impressive new features introduced in 3CX they look very promising.


I wanted to ask whether there are any plans to provide a solution for outgoing calls made without using dummy extensions, so that external calls can be handled and monitored without the need to create additional placeholder extensions to do it via the sip provider is not an option (also in version 18 we were able to do it )


Additionally, will there be support for HOT DESK extensions suitable for shift-based environments where, for example, a system may have around 50 total extensions, but only about 10 are active at any given time depending on which employees are logged in?


We’d greatly appreciate any information on whether these features are planned or if there are recommended best practices within the current versions.
 
@Soli - I don't get why we have to get short changed in such environments. Our solution is very inexpensive and hot desking etc why should it be free?? If external calls have to be handled and monitored by 3CX then you need to pay for this, why should it be free?? Please stop this attitude that we have to give our technology away at some discounted rate. A system with 50 extensions needs to pay $750 a year, what's the problem?
 
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Thank you so much for your understanding. First off we are going to make discounts for K12 schools of course. So we can look into your case and consider the setup to make it a win win. Also, if it really does not work for you and you would rather move to another solution we would of course assist you in this process and refund you future years. But let us first look at your particular case because probably that is not necessary.
I must say these changes affect education users pretty hard.

I hope the discounts also applies to vocational college and universities. Like in schools, trainers and professors are rarely "active" extensions.
 
We are working on group support for the M365 sync so you can more easily sync based on groups and you can thus remove all those extra users that need not be on a 3CX system. This is coming in update 9 within a few months.
That would make things much smoother for onboarding users.
currently I sync only selected users.
It would be nice if you could select multiple groups and each group could be assigned a specific starting range and department.

I'm not affected by the change of licencing :).

I'm a little confused by the wording "Onboard Transcription Without an External Service"
I currently use 3CX transcription on a self hosted 16SC. will there be a change in how it works? does it not work that way already?
The new way requires dedicated hardware?
 
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That would make things much smoother for onboarding users.
currently I sync only selected users.
It would be nice if you could select multiple groups and each group could be assigned a specific starting range and department.

I'm not affected by the change of licencing :).

I'm a little confused by the wording "Onboard Transcription Without an External Service"
I currently use 3CX transcription on a self hosted 16SC. will there be a change in how it works? does it not work that way already?
The new way requires dedicated hardware?
Yes you will be able to select groups.

Currently onboard transcription is free during beta but it will not be when update 8 launches. Then you either need to buy a package or you will need to setup onboard transcription
 
I think dummy extensions will artificially inflates user numbers. Many popular alternatives will offer unlicenced users or service accounts that do not count towards total licencing requirements. Examples might include a way of:
  • Providing custom routing (speed dial or using 'exceptions' forwarding for granular routing)
  • Playing unique prompts
  • Archived staff - for ease of historic reporting and preventing new starts from accessing old user data
  • Separating licensed user and unlicensed admin accounts for security and compliance
In several cases this might be possible via CFD or third party solutions, but this would detract from what makes 3CX so appealing in its simplicity and low cost.

For fair use will going over this result in disabling calling or disabling features such as AI?
 
I think we all need to recognise that the cost of everything in the world is increasing — and development work is no exception.


I’ve been an avid 3CX user and supporter since its very first Windows release, and I’ve worked with it in various forms ever since. It has consistently proven to be a robust, reliable, and versatile solution for a wide range of customers.


The introduction of the Multi-Tenant edition was a game-changer, filling the gap for smaller customers who previously didn’t fit into any deployment model. (That said, I still have a little wish list for the Multi-Tenant solution! )


I believe the Fair Use policy is both reasonable and necessary. 3CX, like all of us, is a business — and needs to remain profitable to continue developing and innovating.


Perhaps this is a good moment for all of us — resellers, partners, and direct purchasers — to rethink how we sell, renew, and deliver our solutions. In a world full of cloud products with overly complex pricing models, 3CX still stands out as one of the best software solutions available, and it keeps getting better every day.


As a company, we’ve also had to adapt. For many years, we’ve hosted 3CX solutions in our own data centres, often helping other organisations build their partner base while only purchasing a small number of licenses directly. This year, like 3CX, we’ve restructured — taking on licensing responsibilities for those organisations ourselves to streamline operations and reduce service desk load.


Change is inevitable — and change is good.
Let’s all be grateful that 3CX continues to evolve, embrace the future, and work alongside us to deliver exceptional communications for our customers.

John
Founder
Inara Systems Ltd
 
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