SIP Trunk to Analog

[VictorC]

So you are saying Ethernet(VOIP) to 3cx as normal and then a ATA (Patton) off a second port and log into both using the same account? So they would both ring and also get the same info.

 

[leejor]

In an ideal world...yes. First off, your provider must allow SIP Forking. Secondly, even if they do, it will probably only work if both the Patton (or whichever ATA you go for) and the 3CX SIP trunk are on different public IPs. You would need to discuss, with your provider, exactly what you intend to do, and they should be able tell you if it will work, and put forward any issues that they foresee.

 

[eddv123]

I concur with leejor. With Analogue it is all or nothing (no migration). If you are keeping the POTS lines configure the Patton with 3CX as normal and test out of hours. When ready to move over to SIP trunks simply remove the gateway and lines.

FYI the migration for ISDN with a Patton if you ever come across it can use the high precision clock models: https://www.patton.com/voipnews/v1n1/high-precision-smartnodes.asp

These might be used for example in a scenario where you are migrating a system and not retaining or have a BT ISDN connection, the high-precision clock provides the clocking to the PBX like BT.

There is an extra port for connecting the Legacy PBX to SIP trunking.
These models would be the Patton SN4971/1E

 

[VictorC]

Hi Eddv, not that easy. We would like to go to VOIP with no POT lines. The problem is making 3CX and the old Analog POS system work. It looks like we will need more info on the system they are using. If there is a box that will take Ethernet in and spit out both Analog for the old system and Ethernet for the 3CX than we would be good. It would even be ok if is was all Analog and we needed to reconvert thru a different box back to Ethernet.

 

[eddv123]

Well you can setup an interface on the Patton to register a SIP trunk to no issues, but I think getting this to pass through as well as getting the analogue to work in sync with 3CX is going to be a challenge.

Find out more about the system as well as why it is crucial that it is kept in place.

 

[leejor]

One big issue you would have, if you were able to have both SIP and analogue trunks existing at the same time AND going to two places...is...what happens on incoming calls? They ring on both systems, depending on who (which system) answers first, that system now has the call. There is no "transferring" it over to the other system. Are you planning on having two phones on each desk? Just sounds like a lot of confusion.

Having two "live" systems, co-existing, in the same business, is not a good idea.

 

[VictorC]

No not at all, the old system is a Point of Sale system, I'm not sure what all they use it for but it's not a phone system at all. What we would like to do is move over to SIP from the POTS lines. I'm also not sure how the system works now, if it answers it or if data is pasted thru the system they have now.

One big issue you would have, if you were able to have both SIP and analogue trunks existing at the same time AND going to two places...is...what happens on incoming calls? They ring on both systems, depending on who (which system) answers first, that system now has the call. There is no "transferring" it over to the other system. Are you planning on having two phones on each desk? Just sounds like a lot of confusion.

Having two "live" systems, co-existing, in the same business, is not a good idea.

 

[leejor]

POS...point of sale (didn't click), ok, that's a different story. I think you may have some issues running, what is essentially a modem, through ATA's, and 3CX. Trying to get Fax working when there is a "standard" ( t.38), is enough of a headache. If it is really low speed, say 2400/4800 bps, then maybe, but, I'd do some research regarding VoIP, and in particular using the terminals involved. I'm sure that the company that supplies them has had some users attempting to move to VoIP, and can make some suggestions for hardware, before you start to shell out some cash.

I also question the need for a PBX, when using terminals. Is it to lower costs by sharing the trunks? It would seem to be a bit of overkill, unless there is something else involved, besides POS terminals.

 

[eddv123]

Once again, I concur with Leejor, we have never had much success using analogue Modem/Till type/PDQ machine products through with any gateway regardless.

The advice I would give unfortunately is always to replace your legacy kit with ones that support IP.

 

[VictorC]

The problem is the legacy 2 year old POS system was 70K .. they are NOT going to replace it anytime soon

 

[craigreilly]

FXS gives you analog stations. Then you plug your fax, old phone, alarm, etc. into it. Easy peasy.

Have you successfully had Alarm working on an ATA? I could get it to dial - but the tones were never recognized.

 

[eddv123]

We recommend ATA's for single Analogue extensions, bells or ringers.

Patton do the MATA - and the newer SN102 ATA product, works well with these but we could never get FAX to work reliably with them, and thus never recommend FAX for an ATA (SN 4112 JS only).

https://www.patton.com/datasheet/SN100_Series-A4_datasheet.pdf

 

[eddv123]

VictorC,

Where I find Patton products really good, flexible and reliable I doubt they would have one that would facilitate this requirement. I would suggest contact them directly to get clarity as they may have had experience with this request and thus could suggest an alternative:
https://www.patton.com/company/contact-us.asp

 

[leejor]

As I suggested earlier...speak to the company that supplies the POS terminals. They may have some suggestions as to which ATA's have proven themselves to work reliably for other customers using their equipment. No point in guessing. You really want to know if there are any makes/models to avoid. Or, if this is even something worth the time and effort.

 

[VictorC]

At this point I'm not sure it's worth the time and all the headache of getting it all reliable. I'd rather pass on a job then my rep take a hit for something that will not work...

 

[VictorC]

more info on this, anyone see this before, The setup now is POT lines to this and just forked over to a old phone system.

 

[lneblett]

yes,
http://www.callerid.com/products/caller-id-only-basic/
l

Basically, it logs the calls and passes same to the POS system so they can take an order and associate it to the caller. Adelo and Restaurant Pro POS systems may use this type of device. It is not really forked over, but rather there is a duplex feed that feeds both the phone system and the devcice and then the device feeds the CID to the POS system and creates a POP by which an order can be placed to go (at least in the food industry).

You would most likely need to know which POS system and then contact them and ask how they handle if the business has a VoIP system.

 

[cobaltit]

At this point I'm not sure it's worth the time and all the headache of getting it all reliable. I'd rather pass on a job then my rep take a hit for something that will not work...

We have a winner!

 

[eddv123]

By the looks of the device you have posted (this has made things much clearer) it would normally plug into a phone line (it plugs into a BT phone line, just like a telephone) however if there is no BT service available anymore then you can use an FXS gateway (Patton 4110 JS range).

This is a very simple device, it listens for the pre-ring FSK, decodes it and then outputs via serial/Ethernet as programmed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frequency-shift_keying