Question about deploy scenario

[Hoygen83]

Hello,
I've been tasked with the following activity:
In the same network.
Deploy a master pbx with 3 digit extensions under windows 10.
Deploy a slave pbx with 4 digit extensions under Raspberry PI 4 B.
Can that be done?

 

[VasilisV_3CX]

Hi @Hoygen83,

You certainly can be done. Give it a go.

 

[Alphabetic]

For redundancy or to have 2 separate 3CX instances?

If the latter, you'd ideally need 2 seperate DHCP networks for opt 66 to minimise admin for phone deployments.

Otherwise, https://www.3cx.com/docs/failover/

 

[Hoygen83]

To have 2 separate 3CX instances?

If the latter, you'd ideally need 2 seperate DHCP networks for opt 66 to minimise admin for phone deployments.

Hello,
the second 3cx (the raspberry one) would be in the same network of the first.
10.10.10.200/24
where
10.10.10.200 is the gateway
10.10.10.174 is the windows 10 3cx with 3 digits
10.10.10.226 is the raspberry pi 4 3cx with 4 digits
there are few ip phones free in the network, all the other phones are connected to several neogate gateways.
10.10.10.230
10.10.10.231
10.10.10.232
10.10.10.233
10.10.10.234
10.10.10.235
10.10.10.236
10.10.10.237
10.10.10.238
10.10.10.239
10.10.10.240
10.10.10.241
10.10.10.244
10.10.10.246
Reading the config files of all the devices I noticed that in neogate gateway 10.10.10.231 there are phones with 3 digits and phones with 4 digits, could that be a problem in this kind of enviroment? If it is, should I plug all the 3 digits phones to the same Neogates and all the 4 digits to the remaining?

 

[Alphabetic]

Hello,
the second 3cx (the raspberry one) would be in the same network of the first.
10.10.10.200/24
where
10.10.10.200 is the gateway
10.10.10.174 is the windows 10 3cx with 3 digits
10.10.10.226 is the raspberry pi 4 3cx with 4 digits
there are few ip phones free in the network, all the other phones are connected to several neogate gateways.
10.10.10.230
10.10.10.231
10.10.10.232
10.10.10.233
10.10.10.234
10.10.10.235
10.10.10.236
10.10.10.237
10.10.10.238
10.10.10.239
10.10.10.240
10.10.10.241
10.10.10.244
10.10.10.246
Reading the config files of all the devices I noticed that in neogate gateway 10.10.10.231 there are phones with 3 digits and phones with 4 digits, could that be a problem in this kind of enviroment? If it is, should I plug all the 3 digits phones to the same Neogates and all the 4 digits to the remaining?

I'm not fully understanding your network topology here.

How many gateways have you got? How many DHCP servers?

What are you trying to achieve?

https://www.3cx.com/blog/docs/network-configurations-supported-3cx-phone-system/

How are you provisioning your phones?

Have you configured opt 66?

 

[Hoygen83]

that customer has only one gateway for the network; 10.10.10.200 is the gateway and firewall.
several analog phones are connected to neogate devices (called neogate gateways but with the only function to connect analog phones to 3cx)
there is only one network at the moment without opt 66 and the network is 10.10.10.200/24.
I can associate different public ip and local ip to each 3cx-pbx.
Right now they have a single 3cx-pbx with both 3 digits and 4 digits extensions, something that has been done years ago and that now is giving instability issues.
The network can be considered a Simple Network: VoIP and Data are transmitted within a single network.
What I am asked to achieve is to have in that network one 3cx that manages 3 digit extensions and the other one that manages 4 digit extensions.
I hope I have explained but feel free to ask.

 

[Alphabetic]

Yes, this clears things up.

You would need another license to run the 2nd PBX too.

You'd need to export those 4 digit extensions out of the PBX and into your new one.

Have you considered changing the 4 digit to 3 so you have them all on the one?

 

[Hoygen83]

You would need another license to run the 2nd PBX too.

You'd need to export those 4 digit extensions out of the PBX and into your new one.

Have you considered changing the 4 digit to 3 so you have them all on the one?

The first time I proposed exactly to have all the extensions in 4 digits and in only one 3cx, to avoid any possible issue.
My concern is about having 2 pbx in the same network/subnet, and having some neogate that are now configured with 3 digits and 4 digits that should be managed from two different pbx.

 

[NickD_3CX]

The first time I proposed exactly to have all the extensions in 4 digits and in only one 3cx, to avoid any possible issue.
My concern is about having 2 pbx in the same network/subnet, and having some neogate that are now configured with 3 digits and 4 digits that should be managed from two different pbx.

Don't worry at all, in our lab network there are times where we have 30 PBXs and 150 devices going.
If you configure all devices correctly to be registered to the right 3CX installation, you should be fine.

For the bridging though, don't forget of course to use the Local IP Addresses.

Also, I would suggest having the ports forwarded from the outside on only one PBX, the one you have your SIP Trunks on, because likely the 2 3CX systems will have the same ports, whcih to communicate with each other is not a problem, but NATing will be a problem...

 

[servicedesk@technology4you]

Thanks NickD for the support, can I add any questions?
1) Does the slave switchboard need to have a public IP? Or during the installation phase can I give the same IP as the Master but changing the ports? (I only need access to the slave to create extensions or modify queues)
2) Can incoming calls, through queues, cause both 4-digit and 3-digit extensions to ring at the same time?
3) Being a hotel from the rooms, by pressing 9 they must call reception extensions, to do this I use the SIP URI ID by enabling it in the 3CX network parameters, I must enable the SIP ID only on the master or on the master and on the slave creating 2 different call queues ?

 

[NickD_3CX]

1) Does the slave switchboard need to have a public IP? Or during the installation phase can I give the same IP as the Master but changing the ports? (I only need access to the slave to create extensions or modify queues)

You can use different HTTP/S ports for access to the WebClients.

2) Can incoming calls, through queues, cause both 4-digit and 3-digit extensions to ring at the same time?

Yes, but it is not 100% straight forward. You will create the Q on e.g. the 3-digit PBX. then on this PBX, you need to create a new Extension, in the Mobile Number of that new Extension put the 4-digit extension of the other PBX that you want to ring, then enable "Ring my mobile simultaneously". You need to do this on all extensions you want to ring.
Also remember that this will use double licenses as you will be making outbound calls "Outside your PBX" (to the other side of the bridge) and it will be using licenses on both PBXs
So, yes, you can do it, it is a matter though if you *WANT* to do it.

3) Being a hotel from the rooms, by pressing 9 they must call reception extensions, to do this I use the SIP URI ID by enabling it in the 3CX network parameters, I must enable the SIP ID only on the master or on the master and on the slave creating 2 different call queues ?

You can use the "trick" explained above. Choose which PBX the real Reception Queue will be on, then on the other create a new Extension, mobile number the Queue on the other PBX, Ring mobile simultaneously, in this case though don't forget the "Accept multiple calls" options as well.

 

[Evolute IT]

Thanks NickD for the support, can I add any questions?
1) Does the slave switchboard need to have a public IP? Or during the installation phase can I give the same IP as the Master but changing the ports? (I only need access to the slave to create extensions or modify queues)
2) Can incoming calls, through queues, cause both 4-digit and 3-digit extensions to ring at the same time?
3) Being a hotel from the rooms, by pressing 9 they must call reception extensions, to do this I use the SIP URI ID by enabling it in the 3CX network parameters, I must enable the SIP ID only on the master or on the master and on the slave creating 2 different call queues ?

I'm curious:

1. Why 2 systems?
2. Why the Neogates?

 

[servicedesk@technology4you]

You can use different HTTP/S ports for access to the WebClients.


Yes, but it is not 100% straight forward. You will create the Q on e.g. the 3-digit PBX. then on this PBX, you need to create a new Extension, in the Mobile Number of that new Extension put the 4-digit extension of the other PBX that you want to ring, then enable "Ring my mobile simultaneously". You need to do this on all extensions you want to ring.
Also remember that this will use double licenses as you will be making outbound calls "Outside your PBX" (to the other side of the bridge) and it will be using licenses on both PBXs
So, yes, you can do it, it is a matter though if you *WANT* to do it.


You can use the "trick" explained above. Choose which PBX the real Reception Queue will be on, then on the other create a new Extension, mobile number the Queue on the other PBX, Ring mobile simultaneously, in this case though don't forget the "Accept multiple calls" options as well.

Thanks for the accurate and quick answers you gave us, all very clear !!

 

[servicedesk@technology4you]

I'm curious:

1. Why 2 systems?
2. Why the Neogates?

Frederick Marcoux is a 6 year old installation when we still had 3CX V14 which with a trick allowed the possibility to manage 3 and 4 digits at the same time in the same PBX.
To answer your questions:
1) The hotel is unique but the buildings are 2, different pricing levels and above all different extension numbers 3 digits in one case 4 digits in another, in order to correctly manage 3 and 4-digit extensions I must necessarily set 2 PBX 3CX with PRO license (to better manage even the master slave part)
2) The customer already had the neogate and in 6 years never a problem, the customer does not want to change them.

 

[Evolute IT]

Frederick Marcoux is a 6 year old installation when we still had 3CX V14 which with a trick allowed the possibility to manage 3 and 4 digits at the same time in the same PBX.
To answer your questions:
1) The hotel is unique but the buildings are 2, different pricing levels and above all different extension numbers 3 digits in one case 4 digits in another, in order to correctly manage 3 and 4-digit extensions I must necessarily set 2 PBX 3CX with PRO license (to better manage even the master slave part)
2) The customer already had the neogate and in 6 years never a problem, the customer does not want to change them.

Well, I've never used Neogate so good luck with those! They'll need manual setup.

Yes will indeed need 2 instances for this. We have a customer in the same situation (they have 3 instances.) I didn't know v14 could do that.

 

[servicedesk@technology4you]

Yes manual setup , legacy mode , but only 3 parameters server , user and pass. Taking that shortcut with the V14 forces us to reprogram everything now, sometimes it's better to avoid shortcuts

 

[Hoygen83]

You can use different HTTP/S ports for access to the WebClients.


Yes, but it is not 100% straight forward. You will create the Q on e.g. the 3-digit PBX. then on this PBX, you need to create a new Extension, in the Mobile Number of that new Extension put the 4-digit extension of the other PBX that you want to ring, then enable "Ring my mobile simultaneously". You need to do this on all extensions you want to ring.
Also remember that this will use double licenses as you will be making outbound calls "Outside your PBX" (to the other side of the bridge) and it will be using licenses on both PBXs
So, yes, you can do it, it is a matter though if you *WANT* to do it.


You can use the "trick" explained above. Choose which PBX the real Reception Queue will be on, then on the other create a new Extension, mobile number the Queue on the other PBX, Ring mobile simultaneously, in this case though don't forget the "Accept multiple calls" options as well.

Thank you very much for the anwers.
Lets say we are forced to put all the sip trunks in the 3 digit 3cx.
And let's say that the 4 digit 3cx has no sip trunks.
Can I make the outbound rule of the 4 digit 3cx in a way that all the calls going out are managed from the 3 digit pbx?
In that case if one of the extensions in the 4 digit pbx want to call an external number, it should use a specific sip trunk in the 3 digit pbx.
So let's say 4645 has to call an external number.
The call could go out using an outbound rule in the 3 digit pbx ?
If it could, i am missing how I can say in an outbound rule in the 3 digit pbx that calls from 4645 (wich is an extension in the other pbx) use SipTrunkSpecificFor4645.

 

[NickD_3CX]

So let's say 4645 has to call an external number.
The call could go out using an outbound rule in the 3 digit pbx ?
If it could, i am missing how I can say in an outbound rule in the 3 digit pbx that calls from 4645 (wich is an extension in the other pbx) use SipTrunkSpecificFor4645.

Right now, no, this is not possible.
While the 4-digit PBX will be able to make outbound calls via the 3-digit PBX, the Outbound Rules on the 3-digit PBX cannot 'filter' calls based on the source number, because the source will be a 4-digit extension, whereas the filter options expects the same digit length it is using itself, which is 3-digit.

 

[Hoygen83]

Ok, so i am thinking, would it be possible to this:
when 4645 calls an external number, since we have all the sip trunk on the 3 digit 3cx, the call goes out using a specific sip trunk?
Maybe in the 4 digit 3cx I could make an outbound rule that prepend 9894645 to the dialed number.
And then in the 3 digit 3cx I could make an outbound rule that if the number start with 9894645 it strips the firt 7 digits (9894645) and use the sip trunk designed for 4645?
[to be honest, my first proposal to the customer was to just use a 4 digit 3cx, my second proposal was to use the sip trunks meant for 3 digit in the 3 digit and the one meant for 4 digit in the other. but with the customer asking so many customizations this is getting definitely interesting.

 

[Evolute IT]

Ok, so i am thinking, would it be possible to this:
when 4645 calls an external number, since we have all the sip trunk on the 3 digit 3cx, the call goes out using a specific sip trunk?
Maybe in the 4 digit 3cx I could make an outbound rule that prepend 9894645 to the dialed number.
And then in the 3 digit 3cx I could make an outbound rule that if the number start with 9894645 it strips the firt 7 digits (9894645) and use the sip trunk designed for 4645?
[to be honest, my first proposal to the customer was to just use a 4 digit 3cx, my second proposal was to use the sip trunks meant for 3 digit in the 3 digit and the one meant for 4 digit in the other. but with the customer asking so many customizations this is getting definitely interesting.

Just get trunks on both and you'll save hours of messing around.

You CAN call from PBX A to external on PBX B, but you cannot filter in B based on groups or extensions from A.